Introduction

[00:00:00] Jon Jordan: Hey and welcome to the cell video games playbook. Thanks for tuning in for one more episode. It is a podcast all about what makes an awesome cell sport, what’s and isn’t working for cell sport designers and all the newest tendencies. I’m your host, Jon Jordan, and becoming a member of me right now, we now have two consultants who’re gonna be speaking concerning the, I assume, as I say, the 2 sides of the coin of cell promoting. So we’ve received loads to speak about, and we now have Kenneth Wong, who’s the senior director of advertisements income at Scopely. How’s it going, Kenneth?

[00:00:33] Kenneth Wong:  Fairly good, good to be on this podcast. So, I’m trying ahead to chatting about all issues industry-related.

[00:00:39] Jon: Good. And also you’re on the advertisements income aspect of issues. So, are you able to give us a bit snapshot of what that entails?

[00:00:45] Kenneth: Yeah, so I handle the day-to-day operation for all of the ad-related gadgets for Scopely. So, we now have all of the totally different sorts of advert codecs in our sport. So there’s lots of issues, each in-house and exterior, by way of communication that I handle, like associate relationships and inner associate relationships as nicely. In order that’s lots of issues that we will go over on this podcast.

[00:01:13] Jon: Completely. Good, good. And I assume the opposite aspect of cell advertisements is person acquisition. So, constructing out your viewers. And discuss that, we now have Yumin Gu, who’s the director of person acquisition. Let’s go, please. How’s it going, Yumin?

[00:00:37] Yimin Gu: Hello Jon, hello all people. Hello, I’m Yimin, and I’m the director of Efficiency Advertising as we just lately rebranded our crew from Consumer Acquisition. Yeah, so I’m main the Efficiency Advertising crew on the social aspect of the video games for Scopely. Yeah, I’m tremendous excited to be right here and searching ahead to chatting extra about all the pieces on the viewers and progress aspect.[00:01:53] Jon: As you say, loads to speak about. I imply, I feel the cell advertisements scene has been round for so long as the cell gaming scene has been, nevertheless it appears to be from very a lot from an outsider’s perspective; it’s one in all this stuff that’s always altering. And I assume most individuals comprehend it’s gone by some fairly huge modifications within the final two years. So, there’s loads to speak about there. However I assume as a  very headline factor, you each work at Scopely. One of many, I assume, probably the most profitable cell video games firms over the past 10 years, I feel, very, very profitable over the past decade and nonetheless rising quick with an enormous acquisition from Savvy Gaming introduced. They’re nonetheless pretty current. So, I assume the perfect is but to come back for Scopely, however we’re not speaking about Scopely per se. We’re speaking right now about concepts of efficiency promoting and advert income. So, what do you need to break down? Consumer acquisition has modified loads just lately. The place do you assume we’re for the time being? The place are the belongings you concentrate on for the time being which may be a bit totally different from what we noticed a yr in the past?

Challenges of person acquisition

[00:04:07] Yimin: Yeah, nicely, I feel the {industry} is simply an ever or ever-constant altering evolving area. And with it, after all, UA methods and channels are altering too. In my view, the UA panorama as a complete is adapting to 2 most important shifts. One is the best way folks eat content material. And two is how the promoting ecosystem modifications. For the primary half, for instance,  I feel our audiences are extra used to consuming content material in several methods. Like they’re watching short-form movies extra and consuming influencer content material much more than earlier than as nicely. On our aspect, this has led to an enlargement of selling channels. I feel lots of the efficiency advertising and marketing groups are actually leveraging extra like influencer advertising and marketing or influencer efficiency advertising and marketing.

And one other instance, the best way that individuals watch TV can be totally different now than earlier than, proper? Like, I feel we was extra watching linear TV, and now linked TV has develop into extra predominant, particularly with the youthful demographics. CTV has now develop into extra accessible and likewise a extra versatile media platform. It’s additionally turning into a extra leveraged media for efficiency advertisers. So yeah, I feel extra groups are simply leveraging these rising strategies like influencer advertising and marketing, like linked TV. Additionally, with all that, I feel it requires tighter integration with inner model groups’ communications to succeed in a broader viewers, for positive.

And to my second level, with the change within the advertiser ecosystem, all people is aware of about it. There have been so many modifications round knowledge privateness laws, which has led to the rise of contextual promoting methods that depend on content material and person conduct greater than personalised focusing on. So, after all, extra publishers are additionally making an attempt to make use of AI and machine studying algorithms to optimize segmentation, predictive modeling, and marketing campaign optimizations.

However yeah, total, simply to remain aggressive on this {industry}, we simply must, I really feel like, keep on prime of all these new rising tendencies and challenges. As of now, a  lot of groups are profiting from new advertising and marketing channels and leveraging AI much more than earlier than to amass new customers and drive success, however we’ll simply must be very adaptive on this market.

[00:07:32] Jon:  I assume what you’re saying there’s fascinating as a result of it’s the best way I see issues. Issues had been by no means easy, however undoubtedly, earlier than all of the monitoring stuff went. There was a normal playbook everybody performed in opposition to. I imply, whereas now you will have, not solely does that not work anymore, you will have all these ever-increasing quantities of channels, and I assume the opposite factor is for you guys who’ve fairly a variety of genres that you simply’re making an attempt to generate audiences for, then the factor that works for sport A might be, until it’s precisely the identical style, it’s not gonna work for sport B. So you will have these multi-directional conditions the place all the pieces’s altering, and that’s why stuff like AI machine studying comes into play as a result of there’s no approach that human beings may use that, cope with these quantities of variance in a logical approach.

Challenges in person acquisition methods

[00:08:42] Yimin: Yeah, for positive. I feel as a result of Scopely is structured, and totally different  UA groups assist totally different clusters of video games. And, after all, we talk so usually to maintain one another posted on the current modifications we’re seeing. However once more, to your level, Jon, it’s unattainable to share all the pieces on a tiny foundation and to adapt and undertake learnings from each other very, very incessantly. So, for positive, leveraging AI is likely one of the options that we’re adopting greater than ever. I feel it’s simply an inevitable development and a extra environment friendly answer than ever earlier than.

[00:08:33] Jon: I assume it’s fascinating as a result of the essential factor you’re making an attempt to do is, you’re making an attempt to get folks to obtain your video games. I imply, that’s the spotlight. And I assume the spotlight is that you simply’re making an attempt to get the people who find themselves going to play your video games loads and spend cash on these video games. I imply, that’s the headline. That’s what UA is about, isn’t it? That’s why you now name it efficiency advertising and marketing, I suppose as a result of it’s the efficiency of you’re spending cash on this finish, the tip of the circulate, you need to have more cash being generated. That’s primary enterprise 101. However, so with that factor, how does that play throughout  Scopely with all its video games? As you say, there are totally different groups operating various things.

Are there learnings that you are able to do throughout the entire portfolio, or does it break down very a lot into atomic learnings that labored rather well for this channel for these months, and you then throw it away and begin once more? So that you’re not too nervous about having some logical system of the way it works. You’re simply taking a look at it, and it labored. Does that make sense as a query? I assume it performs into AI. I don’t know if that is the state you will have for the time being, however you possibly can think about that in an AI or machine studying the place the result’s you set cash in, and also you get more cash out, and also you don’t actually care what occurs, or do you care what occurs? Is that half, do you consider your experience that there’s that market data that you’ve that may affect the system?

Complexity of game-specific UA methods

[00:11:22] Yimin: Yeah, I feel there are undoubtedly issues that may be relevant from one to a different. However the cause that we now must leverage AI greater than ever is that we need to create extra personalized experiences for our audiences. Proper? And we additionally need to create extra cohesive experiences for our gamers. Our aim is to not simply have them obtain the sport. It’s as you mentioned, play the sport, have interaction with the sport, and ultimately, in all probability monetize in our sport. To realize that, we’ll must be sure that our customers have expectations once they see our advertisements. After which, once they land into the sport, they see that the sport really achieved their expectation. After which they keep inside the sport, retain within the sport. And proceed participating and monetizing in a sport. That’s our aim.

And for that, we’ll must do much more customization, which is for positive lots of effort throughout totally different groups. We work so carefully with our artistic crew. We work so carefully with our product crew, all that. So yeah, for positive. It isn’t identical to as soon as we do it and it may be utilized to all methods, it’s extra like a catered and bespoke technique per totally different features.

[00:12:55] Jon: Yeah, I don’t understand how a lot you may say about this, however I used to be studying an article a few months in the past, and it was nearly sure kinds of video games and the quantity of creativity they had been producing was identical to 1000’s and 1000’s of advertisements. I imply, it was simply completely unimaginable now that the workflow required to create the advertisements to suit all these channels was all the time turning into like sport growth in of itself in simply the quantity of labor that was required from artwork groups. And I assume, however I assume ALA solves that as nicely, does it? Or possibly it doesn’t, I don’t know.

AI in artistic manufacturing processes

[00:13:35] Yimin: Yeah, I imply, I feel generative AI is now additionally turning into a extra leveraged instrument in efficiency advertising and marketing as nicely. I’ve seen it being utilized to lots of artistic manufacturing processes, particularly with less complicated property like iterations including voiceover or having some easy localisations. So it’s, it undoubtedly has offered lots of worth. However once more, I feel proper now, it nonetheless wants lots of extra handbook human enter. For extra sophisticated initiatives, I feel we nonetheless have to depend on our inner artistic crew to provide the property and cater for this extra personalized expertise for our customers.

[00:14:37] Jon: And I assume going again to AI solves all of it, one factor that I may do if that was not bounded by your handbook enter is clearly you possibly can come out with advertisements that had been actually profitable or actually profitable by way of driving audits, however they weren’t coherent to your sport. And I assume in {industry}, there have all the time been individuals who have made up advertisements that had nothing to do with their sport, which clearly works rather well, however equally, that’s, I assume, from a status perspective, that’s not one thing that respected firms like Scopely need to become involved with.

Significance of name enforcement

[00:15:12] Yimin: Yeah, completely. I feel everyone knows what sort of advertisements you’re speaking about, and we’ve in all probability seen them like 100 instances. That’s precisely why we nonetheless have to have human enter into all this content material. Having some core values and model enforcement is certainly crucial in all of the messaging that we ship to our audiences. So, for positive, as a UA crew, we work carefully with our model crew for lots of the asset approval as nicely to be sure that we’re following our model pointers to ship the core values to our audiences.

[00:15:59] Jon: And one closing factor on this level, you talked about the influencers just a few instances, and I assume influencers, I don’t know, 5 – 6 years in the past, once they first began coming in, we noticed various exercise round that, nevertheless it appeared like in lots of circumstances, it was not very, essentially very sustainable, or it was fairly laborious to suit into the efficiency advertising and marketing circulate since you discuss again then a minimum of once I was masking it you’d pay a ten to 1000 {dollars} to somebody to do a video about it after which they subsequent week they do a video about one thing else and so it’s all fairly laborious to definitely be attributable. Have you ever discovered that the ecosystem is now extra mature, and you may drive a sustainable viewers by there? And since clearly there’s we all the time hear about these large influences and on these channels larger as ever, however I  marvel now whether or not, so we now have this example the place there’s much more, I assume there’s much more smaller influencers who might not provide you with scale, however if you happen to can deal with lots of influences then that offers you lots of scale in a extra coherent approach than possibly a few of these very top-end costly ones.

Influencer advertising and marketing tendencies

[00:17:17] Yimin: Yeah, I feel at any time when there’s a new development available in the market, we have to give the viewers a while to coach themselves. I feel over the previous few years, our audiences are actually extra used to watching these influencer-promoted content material. Now, they perceive extra that that is how influencers make their lives. And so long as I feel the promoted content material is extra easily embedded into their content material, then I feel it’s in all probability a significantly better commercial to the audiences. When it comes to attributing efficiency, I feel there are nonetheless two several types of influencer campaigns that we run, one just like what you simply talked about. OK, yeah, we pay them in a different way. The pricing mannequin is extra on value per content material. They don’t seem to be actually compelled by what number of impressions they should ship, what number of clicks they should drive, and what number of installs they should drive. So we nonetheless view these campaigns extra like model consciousness pushed.

However there are additionally, I feel, lots of the {industry} professionals from the efficiency advertising and marketing aspect are actually becoming a member of lots of these influencer businesses and never solely influencer businesses, however there are additionally groups from larger firms that are actually sectioned out to devoted to efficiency advertising and marketing. And the campaigns that they provide are extra achievable and extra performance-driven. And with these, undoubtedly, it’s a a lot better-fitted sort of marketing campaign for efficiency advertising and marketing.

[00:19:28] Jon: I feel that’s level. It does possibly definitely journalists are all the time considering of issues taking place unexpectedly. And as you level out, it does take a shocking period of time for the viewers to get educated on how this stuff work. And I assume for these industries to develop up and definitely in relation to issues like with the ability to attribute audiences to totally different influences, that does take for much longer than we predict.

Okay, that was good. That was overview of the place we’re on the efficiency aspect. Thanks, Yimin.

And Kenneth, you’ve been very, very affected person there. Raring to go. So, you’re the opposite aspect of the coin. And I’ve to confess, that’s an space that I  know much less about. And I feel it’s possibly an space that possibly has not been altering as dynamically. However what do I learn about it?

[00:20:01] Kenneth: Oh no, no, I’m studying a lot from Yimin.

[00:20:19] Jon: Inform me what’s been happening in relation to driving income.

Transition and challenges in advert income

[00:20:24] Kenneth: Yeah, so such as you already mentioned, proper, it’s the flip aspect of the coin. So no matter Yimin is confronted with by way of challenges, we’re additionally dealing with the identical factor. Primarily, the primary, clearly, is privateness, proper? Privateness is loads like proper now with Apple, with the IDFA we’re speaking about, the {industry} averages round 25% ish by way of folks out of LAT.

So there’s lots of people that we’re not in a position to discuss to and serve focused advertisements to. And it’s a very rooster and egg factor, proper? Individuals are all the time like, hey, I don’t need to share my data. However on the similar time, why are you displaying this wealth of advertisements? And I used to be like, nicely, you may’t have it on each side, proper? So for us, it’s very troublesome as a result of they’re complaining about wealth and person expertise, about we’re not serving the appropriate advertisements, however they’re not prepared to move the idea to us to serve them focused advertisements. So I feel that’s one key factor that hurts efficiency. Bidding, as we alter right into a mannequin of bidding tech proper now, a lot of the networks and companions we’re working with are heading that approach. It’s actually modified lots of our operation, I assume, benefits of getting any huge crew the place we now have the assets to dig into the information and optimize. And that basically modifications the panorama of the place advert monetization is.

After which the opposite factor is about consolidation. Like in the previous few years, there’s a lot consolidation, so many M&As. Basically, what it does is, if you consider the folks within the public sale home, you will have fewer and fewer gamers. So you will have fewer and fewer gamers who’re prepared to bid increased and better to get the utmost efficiency and income for my aspect. So I feel that’s one other problem.

Final however not least, Yimin talked concerning the shift within the efficiency advertising and marketing finances. So, much more cash has gone to influencer CTV. These is not going to get again to our pocket, just like the writer’s aspect pocket, proper? In order that additionally implies that the pie could be, if it’s not rising, it’s standing nonetheless. So that you add all these components into it. We’re undoubtedly not within the rosiest place. The massive progress that we’ve seen in 5 to 6 years is gone. So how, basically, what we’re doing is holding issues afloat, and the way will we stay up for the following huge issues that permit us to have the following progress, basically?

[00:23:02] Jon: Hmm. Yeah. Has that influenced that slowing down? Do you assume that has influenced the kinds of video games, not possibly the sculpture making, nevertheless it’s all typically available in the market? Clearly, if there’s an enormous rising approach in which you’ll be able to generate advertisements, cash, or income from advertisements, builders are going to be like, proper, let’s do extra of these issues. So do you assume there’s been a  change extra in direction of, proper, let’s actually focus down on in-app purchases, or is that simply too apparent?

Shifts in sport growth tendencies

[00:23:32] Kenneth: Yeah, I all the time assume so. Yeah, undoubtedly, there’s only a shift by way of, if you consider possibly three, 4 years in the past, the rise of hyper-casual, proper? And the place the state of that style is correct now, it’s not useless as a result of we nonetheless very a lot want hypercasual as a result of it’s fueling the ecosystem. However on the similar time, you see much less and fewer, and it turns into an increasing number of troublesome.  And that’s one of many the reason why that area won’t be as, I assume, excessive progress as one other style. And there’s all the time the preconceived notion that, a minimum of for the developer aspect, it’s simpler to transform folks than to point out them the advertisements as a result of they’re builders at coronary heart, proper? It’s like they need to make AAA titles. They need the person expertise. They mainly assume advertisements are evil, advertisements are unhealthy, like, you don’t wanna present any advertisements until I’ve to, so I do assume there’s a development. It’s a widespread wrestle with lots of my pals within the {industry} as nicely to pitch advertisements internally as nicely.

[00:24:47] Jon: Mm-hmm. Do you assume we’re speaking about training across the advert mannequin for influencers? Do you maintain out any hope that training round avid gamers will imply that these opt-out charges change considerably? Or is that simply yesterday’s mannequin now? That’s gone now.

Addressing privateness considerations and person training

[00:25:08] Kenneth: Yeah, I’d say so. I imply, we simply have to seek out new methods to undertake these new guidelines, proper? And I assume that’s the enjoyable factor about being on this {industry}. You’re by no means on the plateau, such as you all the time are, you’re by no means at a peak the place the mountain is like, hey, I’m able to retire. Like simply sit nonetheless and simply let issues go. There are all the time new guidelines, new insurance policies, new laws that circulate into the combination to make our job tougher or extra thrilling. It is determined by if you happen to’re a half-full or a half-empty man, proper? So I feel we’re adapting. We’re on the stage of methods to get a brand new format into the sport that talks about higher person expertise, much less invasive, however on the similar time is an extra income. I feel there could be one thing on the horizon about that, however we’ll have to attend and see. Our {industry} typically doesn’t transfer as quick as I wished to.

[00:26:02] Jon: However it’s in some methods ironic that the massive battle that was received was incentivized advertisements in video games, which, from all the information I noticed, most avid gamers love these. They’d be like, can I’ve extra advertisements? As a result of they provide me the issues which are in my sport. And it’s ironic that the flexibility for avid gamers to like advertisements has now been taken away from them, and so they get these advertisements they don’t need to see. They usually’re not so helpful, in order that they don’t get the identical incentives. It was completely, out of your perspective, I’m positive it’s completely the mistaken factor to interrupt on that.

The way forward for advertisements, privateness, and cell UA

[00:26:35] Kenneth: Yeah, I imply, the basics of the system, if you consider rewarded advertisements, opt-in advertisements, it’s nonetheless appropriate, proper? It’s that the privateness itself, I feel, goes again to platform training. I’ve mentioned it with Google just lately, and it’s like, hey, what are you guys going to do? As a result of quickly they’d comply with Apple’s route by way of eradicating the first-party knowledge. So, like, are you gonna be as strict as Apple? As a result of that basically is likely one of the the reason why my aspect of the coin is to have extra challenges than ever earlier than, proper? It’s about if you happen to have a look at the pop-up and say you will have all these small tags, after which the following factor you see is ask the app to not monitor. Anybody who will not be in our {industry} will click on that button as a result of it’s so apparent that you shouldn’t, and so they’re not being specified what they’re monitoring, not a minimum of in a daring assertion of, hey, we don’t care about who you might be and the place you reside. We don’t know these issues. We don’t know your banking data. We simply need to serve you extra moderately, associated to you. And that’s the expertise that everybody desires. And I feel that’s the place it has to come back from on the prime, if you happen to like, on the very prime by way of platform. If the platform does job in pure training, everybody inside the ecosystem will profit from it. So, after all, that’s larger and simpler mentioned than carried out as a result of they’ve a billion-dollar {industry} that’s searching for a billion enterprise right now, and they should run on it. So yeah, we’ll, we’ll see what occurs, however I don’t assume it’s the format itself, however extra concerning the person training.

[00:28:09] Jon: Yeah. Good level. Nicely, as we come to the tip, I assume I’ll ask each of you, Yimin, we’ll go for you first. What do you assume within the subsequent yr or so, do you see, do you assume there’s gonna be any sudden modifications? Is there gonna be any step-by-step operate happening there with one thing like AI coming in or, as a lot as anybody can see the long run? How do you see that one enjoying out?

[00:28:46] Yimin: Yeah, I assume we’ve already touched a bit bit, however the usage of AI is certainly going to be an increasing number of prevailing. We already are seeing it being utilized in creating promoting property. And possibly it’s additionally being utilized in, like, sport artwork creation as nicely. Proper? And I feel as extra firms are going multi-platform, there’s in all probability a rising effort to create unified person profiles throughout totally different gadgets and platforms whereas we nonetheless respect person privateness and all the pieces. And I feel AI can be in all probability going to be leveraged loads on this complete course of as nicely. The applied sciences have develop into extra refined, and so they can already ship extra related content material and advertisements, however I feel sooner or later, it’s gonna get a bit extra superior. And yeah, I feel, as Kenneth talked about earlier, we’ve seen lots of M&As within the {industry} up to now years. Now, there are fewer however larger gamers available in the market.

And to this complete hit subject about extra moral and sustainable promoting practices, I feel we want all stakeholders within the area to collaborate extra and collectively, possibly we’d have the ability to work in direction of establishing some higher practices for person privateness and knowledge administration. Yeah, however like, I feel it’s all my private perspective into the way forward for cell UA, however the {industry} is simply so dynamic, and it may be influenced by lots of surprising occasions and new technical breakthroughs that we presently don’t know, proper? So yeah, we’ll simply have to remain adaptable and stay knowledgeable of the most recent.

[00:31:20] Jon: It’s definitely fascinating if there was, and I feel there possibly is a long-term development in direction of folks proudly owning their very own knowledge. After which that creates some fascinating fashions about permitting you to trace them and providing you with their knowledge for possibly in-game property or one thing like that. And that possibly solves the interruption we’ve had for the time being with platforms breaking what was fairly mannequin. Kenneth, how do you see subsequent yr?

[00:31:49] Kenneth: Yeah, I imply, we’re undoubtedly within the yr of transition, proper? So we’re undoubtedly making an attempt to grasp what the brand new world goes to seem like. I do consider that one of many codecs I’m very desirous about is in-game promoting. You see it loads by way of Netflix, proper? Product placement is vital to Netflix’s success. So, being within the period of time persons are spending in video games, I’m nonetheless shocked at how it’s not extra, I assume, impactful by way of cell promoting in video games.

However the excellent news is that there are extra firms doing it now. I feel it’s going to be on the rise. And I feel that’s in all probability one of many higher person experiences by way of promoting that, hey, you get the model in there, however you then’re nonetheless enjoying the sport. You’re not exerting out. If something, the person expertise might be the perfect. Proper?

It goes to all the pieces else about AI and privateness. And I agree Unified ID might be one thing very fascinating. I hear some huge platforms are eager about in-game surveys, about issues like what they’ll do with a purpose to acquire first-party knowledge. And I feel that’s the important thing, proper? Acquire as a lot first knowledge as potential in the best way that they play. How will we create a dynamic expertise due to that? I feel that’s one other key level.

When it comes to AI and ML, I feel the machine studying half is extra associated to the UA aspect, however on AI for us, it’s undoubtedly we’re already utilizing automated instruments to assist develop into extra environment friendly by way of lots of the operational duties, we automate it in order that, we save time and use these time to do extra like out on others issues that could be, serving to the enterprise, proper? When it comes to eager about A-B testing, considering and segmentation, these are the issues which are prime of thoughts for us, for positive.

[00:33:50] Jon: So I assume that’s summarized that within the medium time period, you get, or a minimum of hopefully get, some optimisation increase from simply this new expertise. The AI stuff is clearly going to be vital, however possibly in the long run as nicely, we hope that there’s going to be some extra structural modifications as everybody’s a gamer now. So I feel, I feel the great factor is I feel, folks realized I’m giving my knowledge to Fb, and never solely am I not getting something from it, I’m getting advertisements or that knowledge has been given out to folks. I don’t need to have that knowledge. Then that’s clearly one factor. But when it’s like I’m enjoying a sport that I like and it’s not likely my private knowledge, it’s my gaming knowledge. And if I’m getting extra stuff within the sport that I like from doing that, then I feel that’s a really totally different dynamic. So possibly, hopefully, in the long run, video games will develop into extra helpful for advertisers as a result of it’s not your real-world knowledge in the identical approach it’s for these different merchandise.

[00:34:47] Kenneth: Precisely, precisely. It’s a digital world of information, for positive.

[00:34:51] Jon: There we go, that’s the hopeful future. Nicely, thanks very a lot to Kenneth and Yimin for his or her experience and for serving to us try to unpick a few of these fascinating dynamics which are happening in area. Thanks in your time.

[00:35:04] Kenneth: Nicely, thanks for having us.

[00:35:06] Yimin: Thanks for internet hosting us, Jon.

[00:35:08] Jon: And due to you for watching and listening to the podcast, or nevertheless you might be consuming it. Each episode, we discuss to people who find themselves deep into the cell video games {industry}, the biggest single a part of the video games {industry} and one that’s reaching billions and billions of individuals and is actually fascinating by way of all of the dynamics and what’s happening. So please subscribe to the podcast, and I’ll see you subsequent time. See you then, bye-bye.